Metanet 0ths Thread

[ska]

I'm really enjoying this trickling of 0th runs you're putting out, and I hope it continues! (As long as they aren't mine!)

Yeah, it's fun again. I'm probably not as patient with this game as I used to be so instead of cleaning I focus on innovations as in 39-0 and 69-1. ;) Also submitted a 32-0 run which I did months ago. Sadly, I missed a jump but I don't want to spend more time on this level right now. Some of the 8-tile jumps are pretty annoying.

Nice. I look forward to seeing 39-0 being flexed. Seriously, it's just begging to be optimized...

[macrohenry]

Nice. I look forward to seeing 39-0 being flexed. Seriously, it's just begging to be optimized...

It's not perfectly clean but there's not that much left. I wish there was a way to get rid of the bottleneck but I can't think of any. :(
Cleaned 18-2 and innovated 46-1 and 79-1.

[ska]

Wow! Really nice 79-1! Really bold rocket dodge.

[EddyMataGallos]

Took a few 0ths, the first ones of this year. 34-4, 39-0 and 39-3. Also improved my own 10-0.

I agree with macro, 39-0 was already pretty clean, are you sure you took the bottleneck into consideration ska? Only the end matters.

[ska]

Took a few 0ths, the first ones of this year. 34-4, 39-0 and 39-3. Also improved my own 10-0.

I agree with macro, 39-0 was already pretty clean, are you sure you took the bottleneck into consideration ska? Only the end matters.

To be clear, I meant the end. Naturally, you've polished it to my satisfaction, ninja servant.

34-4 confuses me, especially Eddy's relatively slow start compared to a strong finish. Is this to do with luring drones at the right time? It's been quite a few a years since I last highscored this level, so I don't really remember the ins and outs.

In any case, it's great to see you back at it, Eddy. I hope you grace us with a few more before the end of the year!

[EddyMataGallos]

Took a few 0ths, the first ones of this year. 34-4, 39-0 and 39-3. Also improved my own 10-0.

I agree with macro, 39-0 was already pretty clean, are you sure you took the bottleneck into consideration ska? Only the end matters.

To be clear, I meant the end. Naturally, you've polished it to my satisfaction, ninja servant.

34-4 confuses me, especially Eddy's relatively slow start compared to a strong finish. Is this to do with luring drones at the right time? It's been quite a few a years since I last highscored this level, so I don't really remember the ins and outs.

In any case, it's great to see you back at it, Eddy. I hope you grace us with a few more before the end of the year!

Oh I see, thanks man. Yeah, in 34-4 there are several drones that have to be lured out of the way, in particular, this first one acts as a bottleneck with this particular route:

Although I agree that it seems to have further cleaning potential, maybe with a different route.

[ska]

Oh I see, thanks man. Yeah, in 34-4 there are several drones that have to be lured out of the way, in particular, this first one acts as a bottleneck with this particular route:

Although I agree that it seems to have further cleaning potential, maybe with a different route.

Why do I feel like jp27ace would be able to reroute this?

[Raif]

Took 60-2. Sorry, golf. :P If you ghost my run against van's you will see that I got my lead right at the end. I rested a bit longer on the third gold pillar, changing the positions of the triggered thwumps so that I didn't need to jump that high after the thwump push. Also tied 82-2.

Nice work!

Is 82-2 maxed? Did Raif MBD it? CBF looking.

I have now and there's at least a frame left.
$###000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0000000000000000000000P0|5^576,564!12^756,546!12^36,546!12^396,546!9^60,564,0,0,31,23,1,-1,0!11^36,564,756,564!12^576,546!12^216,546!12^486,570!12^666,570!12^306,570!12^126,570!0^744,546!0^678,570!0^654,570!0^588,546!0^564,546!0^498,570!0^474,570!0^408,546!0^384,546!0^318,570!0^294,570!0^228,546!0^204,546!0^138,570!0^114,570!0^48,546!0^372,546!0^420,546!0^462,570!0^510,570!0^552,546!0^600,546!0^642,570!0^690,570!0^732,546!0^330,570!0^282,570!0^240,546!0^192,546!0^150,570!0^102,570!0^60,546!4^396,570,1!4^756,570,1!4^36,570,1#473:17895697|17895697|17895697|89478609|17913173|17895697|17895697|17895697|97587473|22369621|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|115486993|107374182|107365990|35791398|35791394|35791394|40265442|35791394|35791394|107376162|107374182|35791462|35791394|35791394|35791394|107880994|35791462|35791394|35791394|107374190|35791398|35791394|35791394|35791394|35791394|35791394|107374306|35791398|35791394|17895970|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|89478609|17895765|17895697|97587473|22369621|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|97587473|18175317|17895697|17895697|89480465|89478485|89478485|89478485|4373#

[ska]

Nice.

[Raif]

Nice poll van. I'm going with 6 too.

[ska]

I was on Discord with golfkid earlier, and we were reminiscing over old highscore runs. Anyway, as I was looking over his former 0th on 95-2, I looked to 85-2 (the level left of 95-2 on the episode grid), and wouldn't you know it . . . I stumbled upon a new 0th . . . by Donald J Trump!

What do you guys think about it? Interestingly, the run, while 0.2 faster than 1st place, is still 0.550 shy of Raif's MBD, located below in userlevels demo format for your convenience:

$###0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000100000000000000000000031400000000000000000000FJ100000000000000000000001000000000000000000000?1400000000000000000000C110000000000000000000000240000000000000000000000B0000000000000000000000>400000000000000000000000000000000000000000000350000000000000000000GK100000000000000000000A024000000000000000000000024000000000000000000000014000000000000000000003110000000000000000000000B0000000000000000000000>400000000000000000000000000000000000000000000G000000000000000000000314000000000000000000GK11100000000000000000000005000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000|5^108,252!12^96,288!12^96,276!12^84,276!12^84,264!12^84,252!12^84,240!12^96,228!12^108,228!12^119,223!12^128,214!12^141,209!12^156,207!12^165,216!12^172,226!12^180,237!12^187,249!12^278,307!12^290,314!12^301,320!12^316,317!12^329,307!12^343,296!12^350,282!12^358,272!12^366,262!12^377,251!12^437,269!12^441,281!12^441,295!12^436,306!12^430,256!12^418,248!12^406,246!12^392,246!12^427,329!12^438,339!12^448,347!12^461,336!12^474,324!12^487,324!12^503,324!12^556,367!12^564,353!12^576,341!12^609,312!11^636,420,540,432!12^426,317!12^648,312!12^648,348!12^648,360!12^648,372!12^648,384!12^648,396!12^660,396!12^660,408!12^660,420!12^660,432!12^660,444!12^648,444!12^636,444!12^636,303!12^622,306!12^595,319!12^585,328!12^264,288!12^264,276!12^270,300!12^197,254!12^211,249!12^226,243!12^237,238!12^249,234!12^276,276!12^276,264!12^276,252!12^264,232!12^273,241!12^312,366!12^336,366!12^324,366!12^528,438!12^540,438!12^552,438!12^564,438!12^576,438!12^504,372!12^504,384!12^516,390!12^531,385!12^544,375!0^144,228!0^180,276!0^246,252!0^252,306!0^324,348!0^378,276!0^444,372!0^396,318!0^486,348!0^630,324!0^420,282!12^510,336!12^510,348!12^510,360!12^654,336!12^654,324#347:35791394|36577826|35791394|17895699|17895697|35791409|35791394|35791394|35791394|35791394|17895730|17895697|17895697|4369|33554432|35791394|35791394|237117986|107374182|107374182|107374182|35791394|17895970|17895697|17895697|17895697|51450129|35791394|35791394|35791394|36573490|18031138|17895697|17895697|17895697|1|35782656|35791394|35791394|35794466|36102690|35791394|17895697|19014178|17895697|17895696|17895697|17|0|0#

[macrohenry]

Hey, long time no see! I played some random levels and got 0ths on 26-3, 91-1 and 91-3. Also 31-0 and 93-3 in speedrun mode. Any ideas on how to reroute 91-1? The bottleneck near the end annoys me a lot for some reason.

[ska]

Hey, long time no see! I played some random levels and got 0ths on 26-3, 91-1 and 91-3. Also 31-0 and 93-3 in speedrun mode. Any ideas on how to reroute 91-1? The bottleneck near the end annoys me a lot for some reason.

26-3
Crazy how a simple change-up on 26-3 saved that much time. It took 14 years to find, too.

91-1
Clean work with the wall jumps. I also loved the cheeky little jump at the end.

91-3
This is definitely worth watching in demo mode against Eddy's run. I can definitely see Eddy beating this run—comfortably, too. Nevertheless, well done on getting the 0th.

31-0 sr
Well, that was just sick; what more can I say?

93-3
Cool.

As for 91-1 routing, how has this not had an MBD yet? I could've sworn Raif did it already. I know he did one for a similar level (with lots of narrow pathways; I can't recall of the top of my head). Paging Doctor Raif.

[macrohenry]

Grabbed 70-4 by tiny route changes and 66-1 by cleaning.

[ska]

Grabbed 70-4 by tiny route changes and 66-1 by cleaning.

Wow! Great runs! I can't tell you how happy it makes me to see some new 0ths taken.

[macrohenry]

Grabbed 70-4 by tiny route changes and 66-1 by cleaning.

Wow! Great runs! I can't tell you how happy it makes me to see some new 0ths taken.

Thanks, glad to hear that. Took 09-1, 44-1, tied 10-0. Sorry about 09-1, I was trying to pull off a really polished run but apparently I'm not able to do that. Kind of mad about that terrible ending. ._.

[ska]

Grabbed 70-4 by tiny route changes and 66-1 by cleaning.

Wow! Great runs! I can't tell you how happy it makes me to see some new 0ths taken.

Thanks, glad to hear that. Took 09-1, 44-1, tied 10-0. Sorry about 09-1, I was trying to pull off a really polished run but apparently I'm not able to do that. Kind of mad about that terrible ending. ._.

Nice. I'm going to be honest with you: I was never fully satisfied with my run on 09-1. Kind of surprised to see so much squeezed out of it, even with that botched ending. Regarding your 100% speedrun, I'm currently two columns into it.

[EddyMataGallos]

Nice! I love seeing new activity. A pity about that 9-1 ending which would've put that run over 160, but otherwise it's a really good run. Regarding 44-1, I remember wanting to knock off FairyTail's last 0th, but I stopped after I screwed a really good run at the final fall (which I suspected close to 159) after I already had the tie. Nice job cleaning xela's double cj route in 66-1, N++'s buffer is spoiling my perception and I'm sure that without it the run would've shocked me more xD (in case you don't know, in N++ there's an input buffer which makes tricks like cj really easy to perform, so this run would be easy to pull off in N++). Also great job with 70-4, it's one of those few levels which has always looked to have a suboptimal route because you still need to wait in a few spots, you did a good job reducing the wait with the modified route, although it forced a slower ending and it still has some waiting involved.

[macrohenry]

Hey, I did some stuff:

- Took 67-0, 68-1, 99-0 and Ep32 by cleaning.
- In 95-3 it is faster not to run all the way over to the 1-tile after the launchpad jump.
- For 39-3 doing the corner jump at the start delays the laser just enough to break the bottleneck later on when returning to the left half of the map.
- I also got super lucky and managed to pull off the discussed trick at the end of 95-0 fairly quickly. Thanks for bringing that up!
- I uploaded a Column 60 speedrun a while ago if you're interested.

Also, it seems that oxy has been quite active lately, even taking 0ths on 58-2 and 88-2 and tying 68-1 (just like Eddy, phew!), 85-4 and 94-4. Good job!

[ska]

Hey, I did some stuff:

- Took 67-0, 68-1, 99-0 and Ep32 by cleaning.
- In 95-3 it is faster not to run all the way over to the 1-tile after the launchpad jump.
- For 39-3 doing the corner jump at the start delays the laser just enough to break the bottleneck later on when returning to the left half of the map.
- I also got super lucky and managed to pull off the discussed trick at the end of 95-0 fairly quickly. Thanks for bringing that up!
- I uploaded a Column 60 speedrun a while ago if you're interested.

Also, it seems that oxy has been quite active lately, even taking 0ths on 58-2 and 88-2 and tying 68-1 (just like Eddy, phew!), 85-4 and 94-4. Good job!

Great to see you back! We've been following your progress through Discord. Oxy's 1.4 tear can be attributed to his participation in a contest called LOCKDOWN.

I've been staying away from making forum posts recently, since it often bugs out and refuses to post; it does this on different devices, too, so I'm not sure what's causing it. Anyway, sad to see one of my last three 0ths go with 67-0, but congrats for squeezing out another frame. Cool to see an episode 0th getting some action, and your 60s column speedrun was very nice. A couple of pants-shitting moments in 69-2 and 69-4, but it was impressive that you held it together.

95-0! Holy Batman! You did it! The sick thing is that it probably took you much less time to pull that score off in a real-time run than it did for me to make the MBD. Just an absolutely beastly run. Van said he was getting that ending 1 in 20 times in testing, so it would easily get my vote for run of the year so far. Maybe we could bring that back for just the highscoring community! ;)

Also, congrats to Oxy for coming 2nd in LOCKDOWN and getting some 1.4 0ths! With his latest 0th, he now moves into a tie for 5th with xaelar and raif!

[EddyMataGallos]

I should post an update too I guess :P

--- Update

In short: I took 6-0, Ep32, 58-2, 68-1 and 91-1 for ska's contest, first N 0ths for me in 2 years (2 of those are no longer 0th, well, one of them technically wasn't ever as I'll explain).

In long: ska ran a contest across different versions of N, I played mostly in N++ of course, as I've been doing for years, but obviously N 0ths were awarded the most points since they're tougher, so on the final day I decided to go back and try some activity here to secure some points. Needless to say, the lack of input buffer made me feel like a complete newbie xD It was really rough, I spent hours trying to get accustomed to N's physics again, and the 0ths probably took me several times more (literally) than in the old days o.O Like Ep32, it took me 2 full hours and it was basically a crap run haha! I picked it precisely because it was one of worst episodes. But I swear I couldn't handle even a little more cleanliness. I can conclude from this fun experience that I'm definitely not making a comeback unless I'm ever "done" with N++, seeing as it's impossible to play both games simultaneously because of the different physics.

--- Review

Regarding the 0ths, I'm super glad to see this late spurt of activity in my beloved N, from you and also from oxy (and myself I guess :P). He and I even battled 58-2 once actually. The crazy thing about 68-1 is that I did the score a day earlier, but waited to submit it for the purpose of the contest. I can't believe you just randomly played the same level and got the same score before I submitted mine lmao.

Mad props for pulling the 95-0 trick and taking down Lim's last 0th, this carries such significance. I knew getting there was not a problem but I thought having the trick at the very end would prove exhausting, so congrats there, probably the most important recent 0th. Also I really liked the innovation in 39-3 to break that despicable bottleneck, seems like the ending could be cleaned a bit but that's it. I'm surprised the change in 95-3 is faster but I'm glad it's now been polished.

Anyway, glad to see this sudden stream of activity and I welcome oxy to the N highscoring scene, I'm excited to see what he pulls next.

[ska]

I 100% get what you mean about switching between game versions, especially at an elite level. It reminds me of playing Mario Kart 8 and then going back to Mario Kart 64 after years of not playing it. It screws with your muscle memory in a very real way. Previously (before playing Mario Kart 8), I could play with friends after years of not playing (and still dominate), but MK8 definitely screwed with the muscle memory in such a profound way. What's weird is that you'd think the games handle differently enough to not enter the uncanny valley; but, alas, it did.

[ska]

Was looking through this page the other day that shows new 0ths: https://ploudseeker.com:5000/latest0th

(Thanks to zapkt, by the way!)

Anyway, Arctic_Pony has been on a bit of a tear the last couple of months, taking 88-2, 63-3, 31-4, and 34-2. Just thought I should bring this to the attention of anyone who's decided to check in on the community. It's not over yet, folks!

[Pony]

thanks ska, i suppose i should have given the update but i wasn't sure if people were still posting here or if everyone moved to discord. i picked the game back up in december, and since numa is pretty slow these days i figured i should finally dedicate some time to the metanet boards! i regret not participating more back in the day. i think my only activity here was in 2011 where i took 92-4 and 66-1. 66-1 was quickly taken back, and i was lucky to have maxed the new 92-4 route so miraculously that one still stands.

funny story about 34-2... it had only been a week or two since i started playing again, i was fiddling around with doing two jumps up the left side instead of one. i kid you not, after no more than 15 minutes testing this out i got an incredible bounce towards the exit and i think to myself "oh! that run was pretty good, let's see how close i got..." and i'm 9 frames in front. i wish i could have seen the look on my own face. perhaps one of the luckiest 0ths ever. also oxy if you see this i'm sorry about 88-2, i just couldn't believe none of the top 20 scores went for that last piece of gold! i had to figure out a way.

according to zapkt's graph of new scores over time, the highest amount of new 0ths in a given year since 2016 was only 18 0ths in 2017? is that right? and even with last year's burst of activity, there were still just 17 new 0ths taken.

anyway, it would be pretty cool if myself and a few people who might see this grabbed a few more 0ths and eclipsed that number. it should be fairly easy, i would think. with that in mind, i'll set the bar nice and low at 21 0ths for this year of 2021. it'll be pony's 21in21 challenge! if anyone takes a new 0th, try to update us here, and i'll do the same. cheers and i hope everyone's 2021 will be much better than their 2020.

[ska]

So glad to see you posting. If you're looking for a place to start, I'm working a video for the highscoring history of 78-3. It will be kind of like Summoning Salt but not as long and primarily focused on 78-3 (and possibly other levels). I know it's a big ask, but it would make for great drama if you (or anyone else could pull it off).

Edit: the start of 34-2 can be done a couple of frames or so faster if you use the slope at the start (as per clux's method).

Edit 2: Tied the 0th. Fingers are now sore; I might try more tomorrow.

Edit 3: It seems the top method is slightly faster, but going down is more consistent. Here's a 102.4 using a manually built demo with a suboptimal ascent based on my tied 0th.

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