Anyone else think Inception might be...

Discuss entertainment media here, including TV, cinema, the Internet, books and literature, and other non-musical works or multimedia productions.
User avatar
Lifer
Posts: 1099
Joined: 2008.09.26 (21:35)
NUMA Profile: http://nmaps.net/user/smartalco
MBTI Type: INTJ

Postby smartalco » 2010.08.05 (15:49)

hairscapades wrote:
HAIR LEFT THIS SPOILER BLANK SO NO ONE COULD SEE IT

Well, no. Cobb wasn't directly injured on any level except the first. He most likely died of those injuries while asleep in the van and subsequently died on all levels, sending him to limbo from the level where he initially died (the first level of dreams). Also, you're missing one more multiplier for you calculations.

I'm assuming you mean Saito. But Cobb also went in to limbo from the first level (at least I think so, from drowning while still dreaming), which would have only been seconds after Saito died. So somewhere you have to pull 50 years out of under a minute, and that is already in the first level dream, so in reality's time, it is 60 seconds over 20, so within 3 seconds of reality Saito aged 50 years. So apparently limbo time goes at 52,948,766x speed, which is somewhere between 6th and 7th levels in our powers-of-20 thing.
Image
Tycho: "I don't know why people ever, ever try to stop nerds from doing things. It's really the most incredible waste of time."
Adam Savage: "I reject your reality and substitute my own!"

User avatar
Depressing
Posts: 1977
Joined: 2008.09.26 (06:46)
NUMA Profile: http://nmaps.net/user/rennaT
MBTI Type: ISTJ
Location: Trenton, Ontario, Canada
Contact:

Postby Tanner » 2010.08.05 (16:50)

smartalco wrote:
hairscapades wrote:
HAIR LEFT THIS SPOILER BLANK SO NO ONE COULD SEE IT

Well, no. Cobb wasn't directly injured on any level except the first. He most likely died of those injuries while asleep in the van and subsequently died on all levels, sending him to limbo from the level where he initially died (the first level of dreams). Also, you're missing one more multiplier for you calculations.

Super spoiler. Also, "I guess" to everything you said.
Image
'rret donc d'niaser 'vec mon sirop d'erable, calis, si j't'r'vois icitte j'pellerais la police, tu l'veras l'criss de poutine de cul t'auras en prison, tabarnak

User avatar
Admin
Admin
Posts: 2332
Joined: 2008.09.27 (16:53)
NUMA Profile: http://www.nmaps.net/user/Aidiera :3
Steam: www.steamcommunity.com/id/
MBTI Type: INTJ
Location: Phoenix, Arizona

Postby aids » 2010.08.06 (13:09)

This picture might actually do the best job at explaining the movie.

Image

Image

//--^.^--\\
\\.:.^.:.//

User avatar
Jedi Pimp
Posts: 667
Joined: 2008.09.28 (02:54)
NUMA Profile: http://nmaps.net/user/bobaganuesh_2
Location: Manitoba, Canada

Postby bobaganuesh_2 » 2010.08.11 (03:59)

that diagram is confusing because it appears to show that Yusuf in reality (on the plane) plugged the rest of them into Level 1, which didn't happen, and same with Arthur and Eames for levels 2 and 3. The airplane hostess plugged them into level 1, Yusuf plugged them into level 2, Arthur into level 3, and Eames level 4 and/or limbo.

assuming that level 4 dreaming and limbo are seperate, Eames plugged in both Tom and Ariadne in level 3 so they could enter level 4, right? And both Saito and Cobb died in level 1, transporting them to limbo. But why is Fischer in level 4 after he gets shot in level 3, instead of limbo? Unless when he got shot he passed out into a coma and/or unconsciousness and/or dreaming, it would be opposite to the movie's established reality of dreaming that a person who dies in any level enters limbo.

my second concern deals with the design of the levels. Assuming that Ariadne designed the first three (raining city (what does Yusuf not peeing before they enter this level have to do with the weather raining? lol), hotel, and alpine stronghold/base) and that the only reason she and Cobb entered level 4 was to bring back Fischer, why does level 4 resemble the dreamscape and/or realm of limbo that Tom and his wife created?

Unless level 4 is limbo, and somehow all 7 of em contribute to the make-up of the dream(s) -- including Tom's memories of regret and Yusuf's consciousness of the current state of his urinary system -- I'd still like to know how the components of Cobb and/or the others' subconscious(es) appear (i.e. the train) in a dream engineered by Ariadne and populated by Fischer's subconscious.

I'll have to watch the film again, because I feeled I've missed something very important in the dialogue. Damn Nolan and his beckoning to nitpick!

EDIT: after scoruing the IMDB forums I've found an answer to limbo mystery, a la the dialogue in the movie
Eames: "Fine, so what happens when we die?"
Cobb: "We drop in a limbo."
Arthur: "Are you serious?"
Ariadne: "Limbo?"
Arthur: "Unconstructed dream space."
Ariadne: "Well, what the hell is down there?"
Arthur: "Just raw, infinite subconscious. Nothing is down there. Except whatever might have been left behind by anyone sharing the dream who's been trapped there before. Which in our case, this is you (Cobb)."
which means that neither Ariadne's nor Fischer's subconsciouses populate limbo, and they only experience what what Cobb and Mal have already constructed.

So there is no level 4; in level 3 Eames actually plugged Ariadne and Cobb into Fischer's dream, which happened to be limbo. Hence, the diagram Life247 provided is a complete screwball.

User avatar
Lifer
Posts: 1099
Joined: 2008.09.26 (21:35)
NUMA Profile: http://nmaps.net/user/smartalco
MBTI Type: INTJ

Postby smartalco » 2010.08.13 (05:13)

bobaga_fett wrote:that diagram is confusing because it appears to show that Yusuf in reality (on the plane) plugged the rest of them into Level 1, which didn't happen, and same with Arthur and Eames for levels 2 and 3. The airplane hostess plugged them into level 1, Yusuf plugged them into level 2, Arthur into level 3, and Eames level 4 and/or limbo.
It isn't who 'plugged them in', it is whose dream it is. And Fischer populates all of them.
my second concern deals with the design of the levels. Assuming that Ariadne designed the first three (raining city (what does Yusuf not peeing before they enter this level have to do with the weather raining? lol), hotel, and alpine stronghold/base) and that the only reason she and Cobb entered level 4 was to bring back Fischer, why does level 4 resemble the dreamscape and/or realm of limbo that Tom and his wife created?
Limbo=subconcious. They wen't in to Cobb's subconscious, which is also limbo, where everyone would be trapped.
I'd still like to know how the components of Cobb and/or the others' subconscious(es) appear (i.e. the train) in a dream engineered by Ariadne and populated by Fischer's subconscious.
The train and the guys with guns (in every level) were there because Fischer had previously been trained to protect his dreams by a different extractor. So they are part of what Fischer's mind populated the worlds with.
So there is no level 4; in level 3 Eames actually plugged Ariadne and Cobb into Fischer's dream, which happened to be limbo. Hence, the diagram Life247 provided is a complete screwball.
The only part that is possibly screwed up is calling something level 4, instead of just someone else's subconscious/limbo. They still had Saito's right, it is just that he had built his own world in his subconscious in the time he was 'dead'. The rest of it makes sense once you abandon this 'plugged in' idea.
Image
Tycho: "I don't know why people ever, ever try to stop nerds from doing things. It's really the most incredible waste of time."
Adam Savage: "I reject your reality and substitute my own!"

User avatar
Admin
Admin
Posts: 2332
Joined: 2008.09.27 (16:53)
NUMA Profile: http://www.nmaps.net/user/Aidiera :3
Steam: www.steamcommunity.com/id/
MBTI Type: INTJ
Location: Phoenix, Arizona

Postby aids » 2010.09.26 (02:43)

Revived!
Picture.

Image

Image

//--^.^--\\
\\.:.^.:.//


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests