N v1.5 Poll: Small Changes

[TheRealOne]

I am glad to hear that you are trying to keep things as much the same as you can, while still adding new stuff.
...
The question is; you made it so that when you don't move on the bounceblock like in the first demo, you will reach the same low point that you do when you move on the bounceblock, correct?

I don't really like that being changed, i mean it's something that can be learned and that makes the diversity or something. But well, with my approach 1.5 would be just official NReality, so I guess my opinion doesn't take much part in this :P As the stuttering 'bug' (as i don't consider it a bug) was removed, 1.5 will be completely new game, so is there any reason to highscore current boards? :O Unless all highscorers stuck with Nreality/1.4, I don't think there is any reason to.

Yeah I don't like that they are changing either of those because they most certainly break demos, but I was just trying to understand the change. I think it was kind of cool knowing that you had to move to make a bb go all the way down. It was also kind of a trick that could be use like if a mine was right below a bb you could survive by not moving when you hit the bb and just jump. It wasn't hard to predict and it was easy to understand.

[Rose]

Weren't demos broken and the highscore board cleared between 1.3c and 1.4 as well? I don't see the big deal.

[Izzy]

Weren't demos broken and the highscore board cleared between 1.3c and 1.4 as well? I don't see the big deal.

Umm, I really don't think so. Between 1.3c and 1.4, there were probably only a few months. It's been years since 1.4. Also, I don't think there were any physics changes between 1.3c and 1.4, so yes, there is a big deal.

Or something like that. I'm pretty damn sure this has been argued already.

[Rose]

Weren't demos broken and the highscore board cleared between 1.3c and 1.4 as well? I don't see the big deal.

Umm, I really don't think so. Between 1.3c and 1.4, there were probably only a few months. It's been years since 1.4. Also, I don't think there were any physics changes between 1.3c and 1.4, so yes, there is a big deal.

Or something like that. I'm pretty damn sure this has been argued already.

Well then this leads me to what I said earlier, as it would keep both sides happy:

maybe we should do both and release them as v1.5 and v2.0, who knows.

This would be absolutely genius.

[EddyMataGallos]

Weren't demos broken and the highscore board cleared between 1.3c and 1.4 as well? I don't see the big deal.

Umm, I really don't think so. Between 1.3c and 1.4, there were probably only a few months. It's been years since 1.4. Also, I don't think there were any physics changes between 1.3c and 1.4, so yes, there is a big deal.

Or something like that. I'm pretty damn sure this has been argued already.

Yeah, there werent any physics changes between v1.3c and v1.4, since 1.4 demos are compatible with N v1.3.

[origami_alligator]

Even if the grid resolution is doubled you will still be able to pass beneath a drone if you happen to slide under it when it is halfway between one section of the grid and another. The only difference is that "blindspot" is now half as wide/tall as it used to be.

[remm]

What you could do, is still have the drones following a grid based pattern, but change it so that if a drone is placed centred on the corner of a tile, then that drone will follow the grid edges.
I think a picture shows this best.



The dotted lines being the path which the drone would follow.
Of course, an idea like this could be potentially confusing with many drones, but it'd be easier than drones being able to go everywhere.

Also I don't really like the idea of having the drones follow the tiles perfectly, I think it would look very cheap and less mechanical than the current drones. Plus along rough terrain it'd just look plain silly, because the drones have no acceleration, meaning they'd be juttering all over the place.

[Radium]

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not fix the oneway glitch.. almost my entire archive is based on it.. classic mode wouldn't be cool with me either :/

ughhhhhhhhh i like new stuff JUST PLEASE don't mess with the oneways

[Spawn of Yanni]

We do, of course, have that ever-familiar "nreality" tag on NUMA that tells people "Hey fuck you original N players, you ain't gonna get shit from this map unless you head on over to the other version over there". I don't see why we can't use a "v1.4" tag for maps that are specifically made for any flaws in the 1.4 system.

Retroactively, people could just keep a note of what map number marks the release of 1.5, and keep in mind that everything before it likely won't work with the new physics. It's been said before but we will still have that older version lying around on our hard drives, no?

[EddyMataGallos]

It'd be great to put a Total Death Count :)

[PONTO]

Oneway bugs are exactly the kind I think should be removed. The objects should behave in predictable and intuitive ways, as much as possible. That's part of what makes N beautiful - a well-designed strategy should only fail if the player lacks technique, not because he is unlucky enough to have that drone not notice him when he's making that perfect run.

If we are going to change, I'd probably even go as far as removing the awkward way the ninja runs on horizontal thwumps. It would make more sense if it were relative to the thwump, not the level. That may be going too far, though. xD

[raigan]

If we are going to change, I'd probably even go as far as removing the awkward way the ninja runs on horizontal thwumps. It would make more sense if it were relative to the thwump, not the level. That may be going too far, though. xD

This is probably not possible because of the model used for the ninja's movement. It would be easy to make the ninja move relative to the ground underneath its feet instead of relative to the world frame, but even if we did this it would make almost no difference because of how weak the ninja's friction is -- there wouldn't be enough friction force to carry the ninja along with the thwump, the ninja would still slide off.

Of course we could change the movement model to be totally different when on thwumps, but we'd rather leave that sort of thing for a different game :)

[Fraxtil]

I'm pretty sure I'm not the first to say it, but I'd love to see backwards compatibility for old demos and maps if glitches are fixed. +1 for small changes, -0.5 if they're forced on all maps.

[remm]

Oh, one glitch that needs to be fixed is when you die from falling on a thwump that is falling also (attacking downwards). The ninja dies because its velocity is above what would kill it if it were hitting the ground. But from the ninja's frame of reference, the velocity upon impact on the back of the thwump is an easy landing.
But you still die.

[Dawiki]

Cool change would be an undo button in Ned. Like your making an awesome dda and u accedentally remove that z-snapped door.. than you can't undo it.

[golf]

z-snapped door..

Wow, even I hadn't worked out how to do those.

My guess is that he's talking about the switch, not the door itself.

[remm]

Cool change would be an undo button in Ned. Like your making an awesome dda and u accedentally remove that z-snapped door.. than you can't undo it.

Um the undo button is \ + click
Works just like backspace, but it removes the most recently placed object.

EDIT: good point triplesec, you can't undo a remove. Something like that would be very handy.

[乳头的早餐谷物]

Cool change would be an undo button in Ned. Like your making an awesome dda and u accedentally remove that z-snapped door.. than you can't undo it.

Um the undo button is \ + click
Works just like backspace, but it removes the most recently placed object.

Can't undo an accidental removal, though.

[remm]

One small physics glitch that you could fix is this one:

http://remaniac.pastebin.com/cL8utg6Q

It's a demo, and at the point where the tiles meet, I jump (the evidence of this is in the demo data). Unfortunately, even though I am touching tiles, I do not jump away from them.

This has killed me many times in minejumpers, all those times I swore I was jumping but the ninja didn't. Turns out it wasn't just me.

[The Black Lion]

EDIT: Ouuups, i've read all the post on this tread, and most of things i say in this post have already be saying. In two word I 100% agree with what "a happy song" has write. Also new Ned feature like better drone patting and placing, or pratical stuff would be really great.

Each objects/enemies have characteristics which make them what they really are. It's why N is the best platform game of all time. Like multiple bounceblock jumps, passing trough chaingun's bullets, cornerjumps, reversejumps on inclined surfaces, Touching the edge of electric surface of thwumps,... Those aren't what i call glitches, they are caracteristic, they make this game magic. But ii will be really nice if you improve the game. For example i'm totally ok that you removed glitch like chaingun and chaser drone randomness, or oneway glitchs, because they aren't logic. They are just bug.

[The Black Lion]

I'm really sorry for double posting but i will show 2 "true" glitches which really annoy me.
First the one way size wich is large than 1 tile, like in this demo:
$###11111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111000001111111111111111110000011111111111111111100000111111111111111111000001111111111111111110000011111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111|5^372,348!7^396,324,3#268:0|79691776|105137220|107374182|550|272|17895696|273|0|0|17825792|17|0|0|0|0|4352|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0#
And second the trapdoor/door images wich you pass a little trough (in the left of the map). So i think it will be better if you put the image on the intersection of the 2 tiles and not in the tile you put it (hope i'm understandable cauz i don't speak good english...)
$###11111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111000001111111111111111110000011111111111111111100000111111111111111111000001111111111111111110000011111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111|5^393.942071381171,350!9^360,336,1,1,14,13,0,0,-1!9^360,336,1,1,15,13,0,0,-1!9^432,336,1,1,17,12,0,0,0!9^432,336,1,1,18,12,0,0,0#496:0|17891328|17895697|33554449|35791394|35791394|2236962|0|88866816|89478485|18175317|17895697|33554432|35791394|34|0|35790848|35791394|35791394|16777216|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|4369|0|35791392|0|71584768|71582788|35652676|35791394|2|65536|0|0|0|0|35791360|34|16777216|17895697|17895697|4369|35782656|2|16777216|17895697|69905|201326592|105137220|107374182|71591526|71582788|1092|35782656|35791394|35791394|88391682|89478485|89478485|89478485|89478485|89478485|273|0|139776|0|0|0|0

[darkshadow]

O.K. Let me preface this. I haven't been around in a while (college and such) but I saw the blog post about n 1.5 and decided to throw my two cents (or whatever you get after adjusting for inflation) in.

My thoughts on this have definitely changed over time, largely because of unreality's work. My feeling had for a long time been "I can't wait for the new version, for things to be fixed and as a highscorer for cheating (though mainly hacking) to no longer be the primary method of being on the boards." However, my thoughts have changed over time from this starting with n-reality. It started with thinking "wow I hope all this neat stuff will be integrated into the new version." But gradually it became "if there is a new version I can't imagine all this becoming part of it."

My feelings on this news are a little mixed. On the one hand, we've been waiting a long time for this. On the other hand, I'm no longer really waiting for N 1.5, I think the updates made by unreality provided much of what I could have expected from it from my perspective as a highscorer. What I'm hoping for then is N 2.0. Yes, there are amazing ideas in n-reality that I hope will be integrated into any new versions you guys put together (SPEEDRUN!), but really I'm all for a completely new version. Go ahead, make whatever changes you guys think will fix problems with the old version (or first version). This is my opinion as an avid highscorer. We will always have 1.4 and n-reality when we want that. So go on, make it different, I for one am looking forward to a new N.

darkshadow1416

P.S. Composed very quickly so I might go back and edit to clarify what I'm trying to say (also being sick doesn't help with one's prose).

[golf]

darkshadow, welcome back! I think I almost agree with you, but the only thing that NReality hasn't provided, that I'd like, is the Metanet boards cleared of the hacked scores.

Also, does this post mean that you may have more time in the near future to start playing/highscoring again? I understand how college goes and the time it takes, but would love to see you come back.

[darkshadow]

I completely agree with you. I like the idea of the boards getting cleared again. I've always been of the opinion leave the cheaters but get rid of the hackers especially now, since we have n-reality for that (I have plenty more to say on this subject but this isn't the place for it). I'll have to see about starting to play some again. At most, it would be an occasional thing. Can't really say right now.

[Destiny]

I believe the blog is long overdue news on how this is coming. I'm getting nervous...