Metanet 0ths Thread

[james_S]

hi guys, Cool Golfkid, altho I'm not sure how excited I am as I should've just kept quiet about my chimneying skills eh. Plus we'd both have to play the map very soon after it comes out so there would some slots left on the scoreboard to appear on..

Why not we all have a chimneying race?! I've made a map now in Nv2 called: Chimneying race -so just search 'by title' and then we'll see who gets to stay on the scoreboard lol

ps. I'll put a reference to this map in a future map so more players would notice it, if some N2 players dont show up. But for now, there's another chimney map called LOOL!! Be fast!! :P -with some good scores on it which you can compare to.

I hope the mines I put there dont make any difference -and Im only saying that cause what de hell is this effect>> Check out my run (with a mistake) on map: Dedicated to James_s. -you can see I got pulled by the mines like they have gravity o_O. Do any of u know what that is???

[_danielr_]

As for the chimneying in 129-1, it doesn't really seem too fast, but well timed (I believe that trick depnds highly on your last wj and the position you make it, you can make it with really slow chimneys).

I heard 129-1 and just couldn't resist. Sorry, Golf. It's a pretty poor run though, so I'll let you guys clean it up. :P
Edit: What's interesting is that the frame count contains the digits 129-1... Tidied up. Beaten by one frame. LOL.

Why not we all have a chimneying race?! I've made a map now in Nv2 called: Chimneying race -so just search 'by title' and then we'll see who gets to stay on the scoreboard lol

Took it, but probably not for long...

[jp27ace]

I was trying to top-20 02-2 the other day, half the time I wasn't anywhere near fast enough, the other half I'd die when I hit the roof.

I heard 129-1 and just couldn't resist. Sorry, Golf. It's a pretty poor run though, so I'll let you guys clean it up. :P

Nice run, I've never been able to get through doors like that, or like grabbing the switch in 03-0

Why not we all have a chimneying race?! I've made a map now in Nv2 called: Chimneying race -so just search 'by title' and then we'll see who gets to stay on the scoreboard lol

Took it, but probably not for long...

I managed to take it by using both hands to spam jump, not really doable in a proper run unless I can be bothered to pause just before I chimney, I barely made the top-10 board using one hand

[james_S]

yea I was pressing both shift buttons also.. Maybe I thought I was a bad chimneyer because its not long ago that I realised that trick and I used it only once before come to think of it, and that time was not a successful attempt.

ps. Just realised I can now get the code of that map with the weird mines effect (just jump further into the bounceblock and it'll happen to you) so I'll try to dissect it


EDIT:::: OH haha it turns out I was bumping into the very top part of the glass panel on the right (hard to notice cause its only a small bit sticking out above the mine)

[EddyMataGallos]

Double shifting doesn't work properly on my old-ass keyboard (IBM from 1993), most of the times it only detects one of the shift keys because of the speed. I made 4th with single shifting (which is what I always use), I doubt I can improve that so Ill have to settle. Very nice run on 129-1 dan, props ;)

Oh and jp, chimneying is not that important on 2-2, I mean, it is to some extent, but if you manage it really clean on the rest (including how you approach the chimnying tunnel, try to get inside as soon as possible without losing speed) you can probably top-10 it, .750 I bet.

golfkid's run is a pretty good example, the chimneying is not very fast but the rest is very clean and managed the top-20. And now even more, if you wish, ghost his run with mine, you will see that I entered the tunnel with around 4 frames lead. So doing a run as clean as golfkid's one (no need of faster chimney) but just cleaning that part should gather a .750 score.

[golf]

Yeah Eddy, the whole top part of the run on 2-2 is really crucial. The chimney will mainly just put an upper cap on how fast you can go.

Dan, why did you have to go and take 129-1? That's been the run I've been the most proud of, honestly. I originally took the 0th back in December of 2007 when ska and xela were battling it out with only one door left to go through. Unfortunately, since I did it with the first version of Nreality that Unreality considered as "legit" runs, there was eventually a glitch that caused my run to lose its legit status, and let Oleary's run take the * spot. So I had to redo it eventually so I could have the *0th again. That is a nice new route you came up with though.

[ska]

Hehe yeah I agree, I'd like to know his technique, not sure if its single shift.
As for the chimneying in 129-1, it doesn't really seem too fast, but well timed (I believe that trick depnds highly on your last wj and the position you make it, you can make it with really slow chimneys).

Yeah man, that's what I was thinking, too. Looking back, I think I might have actually been doing it too fast and wan't getting the proper locked door propulsion you get from slower, yet better timed jumping. Grats Dan for beating golf. Vicarious victory is the next best thing to doing it yourself ;)

[golf]

Grats Dan for beating golf.

Don't start celebrating too soon ska :)

We need a Metanet 0th from somebody to get this thread back on track...

[vankusss]

According to the thread title it's pretty close to its intended track.
I think Kool would enjoy this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3fkZeWsyvo

[EddyMataGallos]

Grats Dan for beating golf.

Don't start celebrating too soon ska :)

We need a Metanet 0th from somebody to get this thread back on track...

Damn true, retook 23-2. This is not a chat room guys!

Btw jp you have a prize for the holiday challenge that M&R can send you home, they asked for your adress on an email didn't you receive it?
They asked me to come in contact with you: http://www.metanetsoftware.com/blog/201 ... ment-14383
If you dont want it then no problem just tell them.

If anyone knows Brocerius you can tell this message as well :P

[_danielr_]

Don't start celebrating too soon ska :)

Yeah, we should probably stop posting this here... *cough hahahgolfItookitagain cough*

[alsojp27ace]

Grats Dan for beating golf.

Don't start celebrating too soon ska :)

We need a Metanet 0th from somebody to get this thread back on track...

Damn true, retook 23-2. This is not a chat room guys!

Btw jp you have a prize for the holiday challenge that M&R can send you home, they asked for your adress on an email didn't you receive it?
They asked me to come in contact with you: http://www.metanetsoftware.com/blog/201 ... ment-14383
If you dont want it then no problem just tell them.

If anyone knows Brocerius you can tell this message as well :P

Thanks for the update Eddy, I've sent M&R my address, however then while trying to update my forum email address I've managed to lock myself out of my account, as I haven't received the confirmation email.

Nice run, I might have to do some retaking this weekend

[EddyMataGallos]

Thanks for the update Eddy, I've sent M&R my address, however then while trying to update my forum email address I've managed to lock myself out of my account, as I haven't received the confirmation email.

Nice run, I might have to do some retaking this weekend

Thanks bro yeah I think its cleanable. Btw the address you sent them was the mailing address right? Not the email one :P (I supose but just in case).

[alsojp27ace]

Edit for Eddy: Yes I gave them a mailing address, sorry if I was being confusing :p

[EddyMataGallos]

Thanks for the update Eddy, I've sent M&R my address, however then while trying to update my forum email address I've managed to lock myself out of my account, as I haven't received the confirmation email.

Nice run, I might have to do some retaking this weekend

Thanks bro yeah I think its cleanable. Btw the address you sent them was the mailing address right? Not the email one :P (I supose but just in case).

I sent them both, as I never use that email address anymore (hence why I hadn't replied before). That's also the email address I registered here with, so I tried to update that too, which didn't work out too well :p

I'm still confused, the mailing address is your home address (country, city, street, house number, postal code, etc, remember they are gonna send you some real stuff). If you meant that sorry for me being so stupid :P I feel like you are talking about your email address all the time.

[ska]

Speaking of 129-1, you're bringing back bad memories of my 16-0 innovation. I'd forgotten about that... THANKS A LOT.

[macrohenry]

Good job on 129-1, you two! Golf, keep the competition going. ;)

Took 08-3 with an innovation I discovered by "accident". I'm sure that it can be improved by at least 1 second if you make some more changes in the bottom part.

[EddyMataGallos]

Heh nice innov there macro, I wonder if thats can be modified fast enough to beat the laser by a whole chamber (by chamber I mean one of those 3 rooms at the bottom). If not, its not that useful really, you can check with ghost mode against xela that you actually did shave those frame thanks to the ending, which was pretyt sharp (and also thanks to perp leap instead of wj).

[TheRealOne]

Well... So much I missed in the past week or so. It was fun getting caught up. So here goes a big multi-part post.

Roger sergeant Eddy! I actually have to unlock that episode first.
Oh yeah check this out I was right behind this guy, I got it on camera also. Last year in Afghanistan. im in Kuwait now..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BHSM2Za ... YRR1zsUMyF

First off. Good to hear from you man. I am glad to see you back around the community. Stay safe and we all hope you get to come back home soon.

@Panstromek It is always nice to see a new face around the highscoring community. So welcome. I hope you didn't feel attacked over the last page or so. I think what all of the highcsorers are trying to get accross is that playing many different levels that center around different meta-game themes (especially NUMAs like my Simple Challenge Series shameless plug) will allow you to think much more in depth and freely about route design and perfection of established routes. However, in order to take any 0th on a particular map it simply takes time. You have to play and replay that map so many times until it is all muscle memory; only then will you start getting good run after good run until you strike 0th.

So I hope to see some 0ths from you in the future.

Chimneying is good basic for some double/triple skill jumps. To do best you must focus on loosening (is it right word?) your hand very much.

Talking about chimneying, I've also always been terrible at it. Good to know I'm not alone :P

I've always been wondering how people can do a perfect or almost perfect chimney while I can hardly do a single jnj,for example for htcjs.

Why not we all have a chimneying race?! I've made a map now in Nv2 called: Chimneying race -so just search 'by title' and then we'll see who gets to stay on the scoreboard lol

To address chimneying. This is certainly one of the "skills" that can set you apart in highscoring. Flawless chimneys can easily set a run apart. A JNJ compared to a JNNJ or JHNJ is actually quite astounding. As one who has done a lot of MDBing I am sure Raif can also attest to this. Just watch his 02-4 MBD and compare it to the current legit 0th. However, this glosses over a major point. Simply chimneying really fast over long periods isn't really useful at all. 121027 is not every map. (BTW James, this is the official-unofficial chimneying NUMA map.) Even more to the point 02-2 and 02-4 are radically different maps even though they are considered both chimney focused maps. 02-4 require a different technical type of chimneying that VERY few have mastered. That said almost all of the the past and present highscorers are at least good at this skill. It is skill at this facet of chimneying that takes runs with them in it to the next level. When doing these "Burst Chimneys" you need to not only hammer down to max speed (JNJs) with out building up, you also need to be precise in the number of jumps. Coming off the right wall; at the time, is key to using chimneying in runs.


@129-1 **Cough! Cough!**
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@08-3 Nice job there Macro. Your run is far from flawless, but I think you definitely exposed a lot of the flaws in that route and and its execution. I think Eddy is right; you run could probably be extended/modified to beat the laser drone.

A little idea I kicked around for this map. I don't really have a route in mind for this little "trick," but I think it could be useful. It just shows that it fairly easy to get from the bottom of the map to the door using the right side. It only require two a two jump chimney and it doesn't have to be perfect. As long as the jumps end with the ninja facing left he is perfectly aligned to get to the top. Obviously the drone have to be out of the way, but that happens quite frequently throughout their procession.

With the 4tile Double:
$###0001110101111101011190600011101011111010111000000:11111111111111110000000000000000000006100700000000000000000001L0100000000000000000001M0100000000000000000001006000000000000000000010000000000000000000000100000000000000000000001000000000000000000000010000000;<00000000000001007000;=:<0000000000001L01000:<;=0000000000001M0100001900000000000001006000010000000000000010000000100000000000000100000001800000000000001000000;=:<0000000000001000000:<;=00000000000010070000:=0000000000000=0010000000000000000000000100000000<0000000000000600000;0010000000000000000;MQ100:111<000000000000E00N00000:1111<00000000P0000000000000000000700D0000NH00000;1111=001001LOOK11LOO001=00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000|5^48,60!9^684,192,0,0,13,22,1,0,0!9^636,144,0,0,5,22,1,0,0!0^468,564!0^480,564!0^456,564!0^444,564!0^432,564!0^420,564!0^408,564!0^396,564!0^384,564!0^288,564!0^276,564!0^264,564!0^252,564!0^240,564!0^228,564!0^216,564!0^204,564!0^192,564!0^576,564!0^588,564!0^600,564!0^612,564!0^624,564!0^636,564!0^648,564!4^204,570,1!4^396,570,1!4^588,570,1!4^492,474,1!6^732,300,1,0,0,3!6^660,492,0,0,0,3!6^660,396,1,0,0,3!12^300,108!12^276,144!12^300,180!12^336,84!12^336,204!0^108,132!0^108,156!0^108,180!0^108,204!0^108,228!0^108,252!0^108,276!0^108,300!0^108,324!0^108,348!0^108,372!0^108,396!0^108,420!0^108,444!11^408,108,72,552!6^708,468,2,0,1,3!0^444,468!0^420,468!0^396,468!0^372,468!0^348,468!0^324,468!0^300,468!0^276,468!0^252,468!0^228,468!0^204,468!0^180,468!0^156,468!0^132,468!0^468,468!0^636,108!0^648,96!0^660,96!0^672,96!0^684,108!0^696,120!0^696,144!0^696,168!0^624,120!0^696,132!0^696,156!0^588,204!0^576,204!0^648,108!0^660,108!0^672,10#565:35791394|35791394|35791394|35791394|16777762|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|4369|0|35651584|35791394|35791394|35791394|237117986|107374182|107374182|107374182|107374182|35791398|35791394|34|0|0|0|35782656|546|35782656|35791394|107397678|107374182|107374182|107374182|788070|71614476|71582788|71582788|71582788|71582788|21251140|17895697|17895697|17|0|0|35791394|35791394|17895426|115343377|107374182|35792486|35791394|139810|0|0|17895697|17895697|17913181|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|89478609|22369621|17895697|17895697|17895697|1118481|0|35790848|35791394|2|0|0|0|2236962|33554432|2

Without and a bit sloppy:
$###0001110101111101011190600011101011111010111000000:11111111111111110000000000000000000006100700000000000000000001L0100000000000000000001M0100000000000000000001006000000000000000000010000000000000000000000100000000000000000000001000000000000000000000010000000;<00000000000001007000;=:<0000000000001L01000:<;=0000000000001M0100001900000000000001006000010000000000000010000000100000000000000100000001800000000000001000000;=:<0000000000001000000:<;=00000000000010070000:=0000000000000=0010000000000000000000000100000000<0000000000000600000;0010000000000000000;MQ100:111<000000000000E00N00000:1111<00000000P0000000000000000000700D0000NH00000;1111=001001LOOK11LOO001=00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000|5^48,60!9^684,192,0,0,13,22,1,0,0!9^636,144,0,0,5,22,1,0,0!0^468,564!0^480,564!0^456,564!0^444,564!0^432,564!0^420,564!0^408,564!0^396,564!0^384,564!0^288,564!0^276,564!0^264,564!0^252,564!0^240,564!0^228,564!0^216,564!0^204,564!0^192,564!0^576,564!0^588,564!0^600,564!0^612,564!0^624,564!0^636,564!0^648,564!4^204,570,1!4^396,570,1!4^588,570,1!4^492,474,1!6^732,300,1,0,0,3!6^660,492,0,0,0,3!6^660,396,1,0,0,3!12^300,108!12^276,144!12^300,180!12^336,84!12^336,204!0^108,132!0^108,156!0^108,180!0^108,204!0^108,228!0^108,252!0^108,276!0^108,300!0^108,324!0^108,348!0^108,372!0^108,396!0^108,420!0^108,444!11^408,108,72,552!6^708,468,2,0,1,3!0^444,468!0^420,468!0^396,468!0^372,468!0^348,468!0^324,468!0^300,468!0^276,468!0^252,468!0^228,468!0^204,468!0^180,468!0^156,468!0^132,468!0^468,468!0^636,108!0^648,96!0^660,96!0^672,96!0^684,108!0^696,120!0^696,144!0^696,168!0^624,120!0^696,132!0^696,156!0^588,204!0^576,204!0^648,108!0^660,108!0^672,10#408:35791394|35791394|35791394|2236962|17895424|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|1|0|0|0|35651584|35791394|35791394|237117986|107374182|107374182|107374182|107374182|35791398|35791394|35791394|8738|33554432|546|35790848|35791394|35791394|35791394|107236386|107374182|107374182|107374182|107374182|107374182|107405926|237167206|36578018|71582914|71582788|71582788|71582788|105137220|105137222|107374182|107880998|107374182|107374182|89478610|89478485|89478485|17895701|35782673|35791394|35791570|35791394|34

A little bit better without the double:
$###0001110101111101011190600011101011111010111000000:11111111111111110000000000000000000006100700000000000000000001L0100000000000000000001M0100000000000000000001006000000000000000000010000000000000000000000100000000000000000000001000000000000000000000010000000;<00000000000001007000;=:<0000000000001L01000:<;=0000000000001M0100001900000000000001006000010000000000000010000000100000000000000100000001800000000000001000000;=:<0000000000001000000:<;=00000000000010070000:=0000000000000=0010000000000000000000000100000000<0000000000000600000;0010000000000000000;MQ100:111<000000000000E00N00000:1111<00000000P0000000000000000000700D0000NH00000;1111=001001LOOK11LOO001=00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000|5^48,60!9^684,192,0,0,13,22,1,0,0!9^636,144,0,0,5,22,1,0,0!0^468,564!0^480,564!0^456,564!0^444,564!0^432,564!0^420,564!0^408,564!0^396,564!0^384,564!0^288,564!0^276,564!0^264,564!0^252,564!0^240,564!0^228,564!0^216,564!0^204,564!0^192,564!0^576,564!0^588,564!0^600,564!0^612,564!0^624,564!0^636,564!0^648,564!4^204,570,1!4^396,570,1!4^588,570,1!4^492,474,1!6^732,300,1,0,0,3!6^660,492,0,0,0,3!6^660,396,1,0,0,3!12^300,108!12^276,144!12^300,180!12^336,84!12^336,204!0^108,132!0^108,156!0^108,180!0^108,204!0^108,228!0^108,252!0^108,276!0^108,300!0^108,324!0^108,348!0^108,372!0^108,396!0^108,420!0^108,444!11^408,108,72,552!6^708,468,2,0,1,3!0^444,468!0^420,468!0^396,468!0^372,468!0^348,468!0^324,468!0^300,468!0^276,468!0^252,468!0^228,468!0^204,468!0^180,468!0^156,468!0^132,468!0^468,468!0^636,108!0^648,96!0^660,96!0^672,96!0^684,108!0^696,120!0^696,144!0^696,168!0^624,120!0^696,132!0^696,156!0^588,204!0^576,204!0^648,108!0^660,108!0^672,10#629:0|35651584|35791394|35791394|35791394|16777762|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|0|0|0|35791392|35791394|35791394|107374306|107374182|107374182|107374182|107374182|107374182|35791394|35791394|0|0|35791360|35791394|35791394|35791394|107397666|107374182|107374182|107374182|107374182|201746022|201375748|71582788|71582788|71582788|71582788|107365444|36071014|35791394|35791394|220340770|89478485|89478485|89478485|17913173|30478609|17895697|1118481|107374306|35792486|35791394|8738|0|0|17895424|17895697|17896797|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|17895697|1|107741184|107374182|107365444|107374182|107374182|73819750|89509888|89478485|89478485|18175317|17895697|17895697|17895697|1|35790848|0|18177297|17895697|1118481

[panstromek]

@Panstromek It is always nice to see a new face around the highscoring community. So welcome. I hope you didn't feel attacked over the last page or so. I think what all of the highcsorers are trying to get accross is that playing many different levels that center around different meta-game themes (especially NUMAs like my Simple Challenge Series shameless plug) will allow you to think much more in depth and freely about route design and perfection of established routes. However, in order to take any 0th on a particular map it simply takes time. You have to play and replay that map so many times until it is all muscle memory; only then will you start getting good run after good run until you strike 0th.

So I hope to see some 0ths from you in the future.

I explained my thoughts in newer post so I think there's no disagreement anymore.

Haha. I don't think I will come with 0th any time. Especially because I don't like highscoring on metanet levels for various reasons. I like highscoring on new levels a lot more.
I explained it in different thread few days ago.

Awesome game time today guys. This is the reason why I like Highscoring on new levels much more than on original. In same time there has been bunch of players around (Eddy, Trasher, James, M4xwell, Aoki, Speedrunner, vankusss, GrzegorzPl, Cerberus etc.) and all of them highscoring on new levels. I started with Remedy (awesome map m4xwell!) when it had about 5 replays and when I made some good run, list was full (Eddy on top :).

Eddy, how much time did you need to take that highscore? I'd like to compare it with myself, because our route is similar. (I'm not sure if he reads this thread...)

But guys, why are you not on IRC while playing? We could talk about maps and runs together with live highscoring, just like on some contest :).

And about chimneying. I just wanted to say that it is good BASIC for some skill jumps. When I started playing, I wasn't able to make 2-3 jumps as fast as it was needed for some easier skill technics. But timing is most important there.

[EddyMataGallos]

Awesome game time today guys. This is the reason why I like Highscoring on new levels much more than on original. In same time there has been bunch of players around (Eddy, Trasher, James, M4xwell, Aoki, Speedrunner, vankusss, GrzegorzPl, Cerberus etc.) and all of them highscoring on new levels. I started with Remedy (awesome map m4xwell!) when it had about 5 replays and when I made some good run, list was full (Eddy on top :).

Eddy, how much time did you need to take that highscore? I'd like to compare it with myself, because our route is similar. (I'm not sure if he reads this thread...)

But guys, why are you not on IRC while playing? We could talk about maps and runs together with live highscoring, just like on some contest :).

Oh yeah I understand that, yeah userlevels get a lot of competition and thats great, but the reason it happens there and not on Metanet v1.4 levels is because they are really easy. The reason I prefer Metanet 0ths is that its much more satisfying to take a 0th, and I have more fun by having to develop more time on a run trying to perfect it, and finally beating long-time runs, rather than pumping up loads of runs. Also Metanet runs stay there, userlevels are forgotten within a single day because loads of new ones appear, and it makes effort pointless. But I agree that having competition would be hella fun. That run took 1-2 mins I believe.

Oh I used to be on IRC most of the time while I played, but now since I barely play I'm not there anymore. I don't have much time neither, but probably on holidays I'll be there as usual.

PS. For the love of god this thread became serious again! :O No more dung beetles anymore lol D:

[panstromek]

Oh yeah I understand that, yeah userlevels get a lot of competition and thats great, but the reason it happens there and not on Metanet v1.4 levels is because they are really easy.

Maybe it is because you play easier ones? I saw bunch of really hard maps in userlevels.

The reason I prefer Metanet 0ths is that its much more satisfying to take a 0th, and I have more fun by having to develop more time on a run trying to perfect it, and finally beating long-time runs, rather than pumping up loads of runs.

Yeah I understand that. I also like long-time hard levels.

Also Metanet runs stay there, userlevels are forgotten within a single day because loads of new ones appear, and it makes effort pointless.

And this is it. Thats sad fact because it makes mappers effort pointless.

That run took 1-2 mins I believe.

That's truly unbelievable. Now I understand why is most of userlevels easy for you. Similar run (just about 40 frames slower) took me about 30 min.

[EddyMataGallos]

...The reason it happens there and not on Metanet v1.4 levels is because they are really easy.

Maybe it is because you play easier ones? I saw bunch of really hard maps in userlevels.
...
That's truly unbelievable. Now I understand why is most of userlevels easy for you

Oh no, I wasn't talking about the difficulty of the levels per se, but about the difficulty of highscoring the levels on v1.4 because the scores of the people are very good (the boards are several years old), so you have to develop more time, the levels can be pretty easy yet highscoring them be really hard. Of course, there are really hard userlevels on N v2.0, you can easily make almost impossible maps, and ridiculously hard maps, but I wasn't referring to that.

[alsojp27ace]

I agree with Eddy, its not about the difficulty of the map itself, its just that there are too many user levels, so the competition is too spread out.

For example I just took that Remedy level in a few attempts, but if that exact same level was a Metanet level, my run probably wouldn't even be on the scoreboard, because people would spend hours and hours perfecting it.

That's why I like competitions like ska's bounty hunter and the recent soast one, because it brings people to compete on a smaller selection of levels, and I enjoy playing the numa levels but they just aren't competitive.

[vankusss]

TRO really... It's one thing to change the title, and another to DELETE OUR DUNG BEETLES!