Metagame Reboot - YOUR PARTICIPATION IS REQUIRED!

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Postby Geti » 2010.06.06 (23:27)

crescor wrote:Wouldn't it be more natural if the soldiers had fast reflexes (but, for example, very low accuracy at far distance, like spreading bullets and stuff) and the tanks lower reflexes but very high accuracy (and perhaps an impact area of the ballistic grenades)?
no, as the tanks are robotic and thus work on an electronic sensor which switches the guns on straight away, while the soldiers are human (and very likely rookies, as the concept in my mind is that the whole thing is a training mission) and thus prone to a reaction time. I suppose you could attribute the lag in a robot's reaction time to doing heaps of ballistics calculations and whatnot, but when it comes down to it I just see them firing a volley of ballistic grenades in a line whenever the player crosses that line. That's if we end up using these designs.
Spawn of Yanni wrote:So where are we at with level concepts? From what I can see so far you're leaning towards a very N-like system (not a complaint, just an easy way to describe it). Do we want to try larger levels + scrolling?
I'm leaning towards one screen levels but I'm open to reasons why we should have bigger ones. I think one screen keeps things simple, personally.
Spawn of Yanni wrote:do a sweet transitioning thing
Love this idea.
Spawn of Yanni wrote:That's discussing things way down the line, mind. Primarily we need to decide what the level design is going to be like and work from there. Also, sounds like we've already got a robot theme in mind - is that the case? 'cause if so we can start mass-drafting protagonist designs and such.
Indeed, I've got a positive feeling for robots at the moment. As stated, levels should be tile based to prevent me from doing too much work with getting actor-scene collisions happening, but I'm not sure weather it's worth my while to get other tiles into it than solid/not solid. If we don't, I can write up a level data parser once we decide on a tile grid size, and a quick editor.

I think it could be worth our time making various "themes" of enemies and environments, like "jungle", "industrial", "plateau", and making the campaign fit around that. If we went with the training mission idea, that'd just be the army training the troops in different areas. If we went with my friend's idea of the character being a rogue AI, it could be your escape from the military and surviving through the jungle on your way to whatever your destination is (a robot haven, maybe a junkyard or something. maybe you're just following a homing beacon, who knows). It'd be nice to get a premise down and work towards that, but we should keep it so it can get abstracted to something very simple (to quote the last thread, "think simpler than N"), to give us some chance of finishing it. I might draw up some tiles and robot ideas today, we'll see how it goes. I kind of like the dustbin-bots though.
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Postby Geti » 2010.06.07 (06:29)

ideas.png
more stuff
trying to decide on a grid..
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"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby Geti » 2010.06.07 (09:31)

ideas.png
still lovin' mah bins
But wondering what your guy's opinion of them is.

Also ick, triple post :| sorry..
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"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby Spawn of Yanni » 2010.06.07 (19:00)

I prefer dustbin protagonist.
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Postby Geti » 2010.06.08 (05:22)

list.png
game object ideas inthusfar.
I feel like I'm pushing a bit much with this. I'd like more input, but I'm also happy with it currently, but I might peel it back a little, maybe cut back some of the heavier stuff for now..
Anyone else like the idea of various zones? Like industrial, forest, desert, etc, possibly with themed enemies? Could make mapmaking more interesting, but it'd have to fit into the story or whatever.. It'd be nice to have tiles that blended each zone together so you could have fusion maps as well (industrial+forest is particularly awesome imho), but maybe we just settle on an overall theme.

Something along the lines of Megaman Zero could be cool too, with all the derelict machinery etc. We'd have to go more hard-out on art assets though.
Image
Could be a good idea to have props and such too, background and foreground graphical stuff. Something to think about.
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"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby Luminaflare » 2010.06.08 (13:13)

AlliedEnvy wrote:I'll say something similar to what I said when this first started. There's lots more to say, but this is important.

N is minimalist for a reason.

Start small.

No, even smaller than what you're thinking.
QFE

Don't start with enemies or anything right now, if you're doing some sort of robot platformer just make a robot with some basic movement and a few platforms to jump to and from. Then work from there towards whatever you find a fun addition.

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Postby Geti » 2010.06.09 (06:43)

Luminaflare wrote:Don't start with enemies or anything right now, if you're doing some sort of robot platformer just make a robot with some basic movement and a few platforms to jump to and from. Then work from there towards whatever you find a fun addition.
Fair enough, though I'm just dicking around with the feel I'm looking for. I'll get basic platforming movement, and possibly map string loading happening and then we talk, no?
Still wanting more input, guys. This can't be a community effort if one guy's doing it.
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"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby mattk210 » 2010.06.09 (07:20)

I was pretty vocal/enthusiastic about the last metagame (to a fault, probably), but obviously it didn't get anywhere. I'd be interested in getting into it again in a coding capacity (particularly physics stuff) even though I'm not really a part of the metanet community anymore. (was i ever?)

But first I want to see some evidence that this could actually come together, rather than just becoming a mess of concepts and ideas like last time. Maybe other people have similar hesitations to help out? In any case I think if you start getting something solid together interest will pick up. And as LF said, definitely a simple start is a good idea, with ambitious features coming later.

Your art is phenomenal Geti, by the way.

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Postby Geti » 2010.06.09 (07:35)

mattk210 wrote:Your art is phenomenal Geti, by the way.
Cheers man.

In any case, I'll get a basic prototype happening tonight, or by the weekend at latest if I get sidetracked. I know you did some work in flash last time, have you used the flixel lib? It's a pretty good framework for basic stuff, but I'll probably need some help getting anywhere far with some more advanced stuff once it's up and running.
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"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby mattk210 » 2010.06.09 (08:17)

I'd never used or heard of flixel until I googled it just then but I'm not particularly committed to any library, language or environment so it's as good as anything else as far as I'm concerned. I'm fairly experienced in AS so that's a plus.

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Postby Geti » 2010.06.09 (09:22)

Sweet! I picked it up in ~3 days without knowing any AS3 going into it so it's pretty user-friendly.
bot.png
Animation WIP, needs scaling and retouching
Not sure how the run'll turn out without animating it yet :\ Caricatured it as a bit of thematic exploration.
tiles.png
tiles draft: tech
(10.81 KiB) Downloaded 18 times
EDIT: ATTACHED ANOTHER WIP, THIS TIME ASSETS.
We're going to need source control soon.
Attachments
robot.png
Current work in progress, it's getting late and I have school tomorrow. Happy with how the little guy is looking at the moment, especially his eyes.
(1.74 KiB) Downloaded 587 times
Last edited by Geti on 2010.06.09 (12:43), edited 1 time in total.
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"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby Donfuy » 2010.06.09 (12:21)

Those robots vaguely resemble some of those in Cortex Command.

I like where this is going, but unfortunately I can't help much.
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Postby Geti » 2010.06.09 (12:46)

DONFUY wrote:Those robots vaguely resemble some of those in Cortex Command.
There's a lot of latent influence from Arne Jansson, the artist working on Cortex Command, in my work. I played it a fair bit too, and modded for it a lot, but it wont run under wine at the moment (>_< what will I do with my time now?) so it's probably not a coincidence. I've got like 4th highest post count on their forums :P
Glad you like how it's working out, if you find anywhere you can help with feel free to chip in.
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"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby crescor » 2010.06.09 (20:14)

This might be way too early, but since I can't do any coding or graphic art or anything like that, I'll ask anyway.
Should there be some sort of background music? If so, what should it be? Any themes or something?
I just got fruity loops and I really want to do something usefull with it, so if I can help, please tell me.
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Postby Geti » 2010.06.10 (04:17)

I would love to make a game that actually fit a theme like Stress by Justice :)
I think I'll go for a different method on the tiles, actually, where the tiles are all one grey base with the edges drawn separately.
tiles.png
like so
Other "feels" could use different numbers. I'll see how it turns out..
spoiler

"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby Luminaflare » 2010.06.10 (14:09)

You guys played or seen any footage of 3D dot game heroes? More specifically the character creator. You have a 16x16x16 area to make your character and 6 different states of animation. Standing, Walk 1, Walk 2, YAY, Attack 1 and Attack 2. Just 6 "frames", when you walk it switches between Walk 1 and Walk 2, when you find something important you do the YAY frame, attacking with your sword uses Attack 1 and throwing your boomerang or using any of the rather zelda-esque items you get you use attack 2. Just 6 frames at 16x16(x16) and it all goes together very nicely.

Now to actually explain why I said that (you get one guess :P), we could just use the same sort of animation system, a very small amount of actual frames, standing, walking (2) and jumping (3? up, soaring, down?) and just add more if the robot needs to use some form of helicopter hat, jet engine, drill which shall pierce the heavens etc.

I'll go chuck together some 32x32 sprites for the standing walking and jumping.

EDIT: Basic standing sprite, critique?

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Postby Geti » 2010.06.10 (20:32)

I'm still a little more partial to the eye style of http://forum.droni.es/download/file.php?id=2311 though I think your legs could work better. Limited frames sure as hell would make animation easier though, so sure, I'm not fussed.
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"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby Spawn of Yanni » 2010.06.11 (10:35)

via Geti: Walking demo; source.
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Postby bobaganuesh_2 » 2010.06.11 (15:48)

I'd like to help out, but the only skills I have pertain to writing and video editing.

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Postby otters » 2010.06.11 (17:52)

Spawn of Yanni wrote:Walking demo
Looks like he's limping.
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Postby Luminaflare » 2010.06.12 (01:24)

Geti wrote:I'm still a little more partial to the eye style of http://forum.droni.es/download/file.php?id=2311 though I think your legs could work better. Limited frames sure as hell would make animation easier though, so sure, I'm not fussed.
It was just something I chucked together quickly in paint. I tried to patch the larger one as well as I could but the eyes are hard to do in 32x32 but feel free to use that to work from.

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Postby Geti » 2010.06.12 (08:57)

incluye wrote:Looks like he's limping.
Hahah, true. Feel free to contribute a better walk cycle
I'll try to get rudimentary physics in place tonight, but I've got a killer headache so it mightn't happen..

EDIT: IRC CHANNEL : #metagame
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"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby Geti » 2010.06.12 (12:00)

v0.0.1 is up, we also had an IRC powow and decided the world could be split into screens, but in 3D. Someone else explain, I'm going to sleep. Above contains epic progress.
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"I'd be happy for a lion if it hunted me down and ate me, but not so happy for it if it locked up me and my family, then forced us to breed so it may devour our offspring." - entwilight <3
How do you know that God didn't intend for humans to be the animals' caretakers? He might be appalled that He gave us these animals to use and we're fucking eating them. - Tsukatu
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Postby noops » 2010.06.12 (13:24)

Wow, the progress on this thing is amazing. One thing I would like to point out is that... If you fall down the ledge, you can't jump back up; all the ledges are too high. It'll probably be rectified soon, so I'm just noting it for posterity and because I'm slightly OCD about such things.

Anyway, I would love to help out any way I can, beta testing, and all that. I could also assist with a story, since leximancing is the only skill I could possibly bring to this thing, due to my abysmal knowledge of coding (re: none) and how unreliable I am with GIMP.

The only drawback I can foresee is the fact that, due to the restrictions I have on my computer, I can only use it for 2 hours a day, and my router only allows me to use it between 7AM and 10PM, EST. So yeah. Other than that, though, I'd be willing to help in any way I can.

The game looks really good. I really, really, really hope that it doesn't break apart like last time. You guys are amazing.

<3's for all of you.
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Postby ℎalifax » 2010.06.12 (13:47)

Geti wrote:we also had an IRC powow and decided the world could be split into screens, but in 3D. Someone else explain, I'm going to sleep. Above contains epic progress.
Similar to the way Knytt handles its levels, the world would be split into screens wider than they are tall. However, instead of simply being able to move left, right, up or down to move to another screen, you can also move back and forth, i.e. in the third dimension. So when moving back, the background would become the foreground and would thus become the new playing area. This, hopefully, will give us a nice 'faux-3D' aspect that we hope will turn out workable.

The basis for the story is as follows. You are a metal dustbin that awakens to find itself on a remote island, in a landfill specifically intended for recyclable plastic products. From your vantage point atop the plastic heap, you notice a metal scrapheap in the far distance. With an instinctual longing in your metal heart, you know this is where you must be, and that you must make your way to the fabled metal heap through a series of puzzles, platforming and combat. You know the journey will not be easy, and that various upgrades and attachments will be required throughout.

The player begins on the plastic heap and has to find their way down, possibly allowing for a choice of which way they want to go. This section is primarily to teach the player the concept of the game, the basic story and the controls. At the bottom of the heap the player will find their first upgrade: the bin lid. This attachment is used for the player's first and most basic attack. The first creature the player encounters will be the lime.

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/6113/limeg.png

Limes are peaceful, non-threatening creatures that congregate in groups, often under overhanging rocks and crevices. The player will choose whether to let the limes live free, or squash them for extra health. Moral choices!

The island the player is on will be divided into four (or more) zones or sections: forest, beach, swamp and mech. These will get progressively grittier and will contain more challenging foes as the game progresses. Ultimately, the player will have to fight their way to the giant metal scrapheap in the centre of the island. This scrapheap will remain in the background, getting progressively larger to indicate your increasing proximity to your goal.

Ideas for attacks and upgrades include: the bin lid smash, your basic all-purpose attack. A short-ranged melee whack of a bin lid. The garbage blast: a long-range attack that empties your contents into unsuspecting enemies. Something to do with flies: all those flies hanging around you must be put to good use. Make them work for you and carry you to the skies for short periods of time! The 'binnocent': with this upgrade, ducking will remove all robotic appendages and make you appear as an innocent, stationary bin to attackers. For a short period of time, of course.


Keep in mind that all of the above is merely brainstorming, and in no way implies that any of this will be included in the game.
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